{"id":11940,"date":"2020-11-18T09:30:00","date_gmt":"2020-11-18T11:30:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/mindthegraph.com\/blog\/?p=11940"},"modified":"2022-11-21T09:55:33","modified_gmt":"2022-11-21T12:55:33","slug":"joe-rogan-and-roger-penrose","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/mindthegraph.com\/blog\/tr\/joe-rogan-and-roger-penrose\/","title":{"rendered":"\u00dcnl\u00fc Podcaster Joe Rohan ve Nobel Fizik \u00d6d\u00fcl\u00fc Sahibi Roger Penrose"},"content":{"rendered":"

Nobel Fizik \u00d6d\u00fcl\u00fc 2020 hakk\u0131nda yazd\u0131\u011f\u0131m bir ba\u015fka makaleyi okuma f\u0131rsat\u0131n\u0131z olduysa, \u00f6d\u00fcl\u00fc kazanan \u00fc\u00e7 ki\u015fiden biri olan Roger Penrose'u matematik ve kalk\u00fcl\u00fcs konusundaki inan\u0131lmaz becerileriyle hat\u0131rlad\u0131\u011f\u0131n\u0131zdan eminim. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Penrose bu \u00e7al\u0131\u015fmas\u0131n\u0131n yan\u0131 s\u0131ra, ge\u00e7ti\u011fimiz birka\u00e7 y\u0131l i\u00e7inde kara delikler alan\u0131ndan farkl\u0131, ilgin\u00e7 bir konu hakk\u0131nda da makaleler yay\u0131nlad\u0131. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Penrose'un bilin\u00e7 ve kuantum mekani\u011fi ile ilgili ba\u015fka bir ara\u015ft\u0131rma alan\u0131 daha var.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Tamam, kuantum mekani\u011finin de matematik ve hesap oldu\u011funu s\u00f6yleyebilirsiniz, ancak bunun farkl\u0131 bir matematik t\u00fcr\u00fc oldu\u011funu, kara deliklerden \u00e7ok farkl\u0131 oldu\u011funu s\u00f6yleyebiliriz. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Kuantum mekani\u011fi neredeyse tamamen Schr\u00f6dinger denklemine dayan\u0131rken, kara roller Einstein'\u0131n denklemine dayan\u0131r, her iki durumda da yakla\u015f\u0131m\u0131n farkl\u0131 oldu\u011funu s\u00f6yleyebilirsiniz.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Penrose, HAMEROFF; PENROSE, 2014 makalesinde evrenin yap\u0131s\u0131 ile beynimiz, daha spesifik olarak beynin biyomolek\u00fcler yap\u0131s\u0131 aras\u0131nda bir ba\u011flant\u0131 oldu\u011funa inanmakta ve bu sonuca varmaktad\u0131r. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Ve belki de kuantum mekani\u011fi arac\u0131l\u0131\u011f\u0131yla bu ba\u011flant\u0131y\u0131 a\u00e7\u0131klayabiliriz. Ama bu ne t\u00fcr bir ba\u011flant\u0131 olabilir? Evren gibi b\u00fcy\u00fck bir yap\u0131 nas\u0131l olur da bizim k\u00fc\u00e7\u00fck, parlak kafalar\u0131m\u0131zla ortak bir noktaya sahip olabilir?<\/p>\n\n\n\n

2018'de Joe Rogan adl\u0131 bir komedyen Penrose'u talk show'unda a\u011f\u0131rlad\u0131 ve neredeyse 2 saat boyunca Penrose'un \u00e7al\u0131\u015fmalar\u0131, bilin\u00e7, kuantum mekani\u011fi ve bir dizi ba\u015fka \u015fey hakk\u0131nda konu\u015ftular.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Penrose, bilin\u00e7 konusunda, soyut bir bilin\u00e7 anlay\u0131\u015f\u0131n\u0131 formalize etmenin ve bunu say\u0131lara \u00e7evrilebilen bir \u015fey gibi bilgisayara yerle\u015ftirmenin ne kadar zor oldu\u011funa dair fikirlerini payla\u015ft\u0131. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Bir t\u00fcr \u00e7eviriniz olsa ve arg\u00fcman\u0131n do\u011fru oldu\u011funu d\u00fc\u015f\u00fcnseniz bile, bu yarg\u0131 hissine sahip olman\u0131z i\u00e7in kurallar\u0131 g\u00f6z \u00f6n\u00fcnde bulundurman\u0131z gerekir, b\u00f6ylece bu kurallar taraf\u0131ndan y\u00f6nlendirilirsiniz ve belki de zihnimiz bu konuda bildi\u011fimiz hi\u00e7bir kurala uymaz, bu da bu arg\u00fcman\u0131 ve \u00e7eviriyi ger\u00e7ek yapmaz. Anlad\u0131n\u0131z m\u0131?<\/p>\n\n\n\n

\u0130\u015fte Penrose'dan bununla ilgili bir sat\u0131r: \"Anlamak nedir? Ne anlama gelir? Kurallara uyan bir \u015fey mi? Bir algoritma m\u0131d\u0131r? <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Bu bir algoritma de\u011fil...\", Peki e\u011fer bir algoritma de\u011filse, o zaman nedir? Kuantum mekani\u011fi zaten bildi\u011fimiz bir \u015fey de\u011fil mi?<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Evet, biliyoruz, ama \u00e7ok b\u00fcy\u00fck, karma\u015f\u0131k ve \u00e7al\u0131\u015ft\u0131\u011f\u0131m\u0131z her \u015feyden farkl\u0131 g\u00f6r\u00fcnen bir \u015feyin sadece k\u00fc\u00e7\u00fck bir par\u00e7as\u0131n\u0131 biliyoruz. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Kuantum seviyesinde, olaylar bizim ger\u00e7ekli\u011fimizde oldu\u011fu gibi ger\u00e7ekle\u015fmez, tamamen farkl\u0131 yasalar taraf\u0131ndan y\u00f6nlendirilirler, e\u011fer bir yasa varsa, \u00e7\u00fcnk\u00fc hala bilmiyoruz. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Marvel filmlerinden Ant-Man'i izlediyseniz san\u0131r\u0131m neden bahsetti\u011fimi anlam\u0131\u015fs\u0131n\u0131zd\u0131r.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Bir an i\u00e7in Schr\u00f6dinger'in kedisini hat\u0131rlayal\u0131m. Schr\u00f6dinger 1935 y\u0131l\u0131nda kuantum mekani\u011fi kavram\u0131n\u0131 a\u00e7\u0131klamaya \u00e7al\u0131\u015f\u0131rken kapal\u0131 bir kutunun i\u00e7ine bir kedi, bir \u015fi\u015fe zehir ve radyoaktif bir element koyarak bir d\u00fc\u015f\u00fcnce deneyi yapm\u0131\u015ft\u0131. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Element bozulursa, zehir \u015fi\u015fesi k\u0131r\u0131l\u0131r ve kedi \u00f6l\u00fcr. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Buradaki nokta, kutu kapal\u0131yken i\u00e7eride neler oldu\u011funu g\u00f6remeyiz, deneyin sonucunu bilmeden ger\u00e7ekten ne oldu\u011funu bilemezsiniz, bu nedenle kedi hem canl\u0131 hem de \u00f6l\u00fc olabilir. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Kuantum mekani\u011finin ilgin\u00e7 yan\u0131 da budur, \u015feyler ayn\u0131 anda iki \u015fey olabilir ya da ayn\u0131 anda iki yerde olabilir.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

\"\"
Ayn\u0131 anda hem canl\u0131 hem \u00f6l\u00fc, anlad\u0131n m\u0131? <\/figcaption><\/figure><\/div>\n\n\n\n

Penrose, kafam\u0131z\u0131n i\u00e7inde olup bitenlerin bir algoritma olmad\u0131\u011f\u0131na, herhangi bir kurala uymad\u0131\u011f\u0131na ikna olmak i\u00e7in ba\u015fka bir \u015fey oldu\u011funa inand\u0131\u011f\u0131n\u0131 s\u00f6yl\u00fcyor. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

\"Ne hakk\u0131nda d\u00fc\u015f\u00fcnd\u00fc\u011f\u00fcm\u00fcz\u00fc bilin\u00e7li olarak takdir etmemizi gerektiren bir \u015feydir, d\u00fc\u015f\u00fcnmek bir bilin\u00e7 i\u015fidir ve anlamak da bilin\u00e7li bir faaliyettir.\" <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Bir enstr\u00fcman \u00e7almak, yarat\u0131c\u0131 olmak, \u00e7al\u0131\u015fmak veya a\u015f\u0131k olmak gibi bir vicdan faaliyeti olmak. Bu vicdan faaliyetleri g\u00f6r\u00fcn\u00fc\u015fe g\u00f6re hesaplama verileri de\u011fil, ba\u015fka bir \u015fey oluyor.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Neyse ki bilim insanlar\u0131n\u0131n t\u00fcm sorular\u0131na a\u00e7\u0131kl\u0131k getirecek birka\u00e7 a\u00e7\u0131klama yap\u0131lmaya ba\u015fland\u0131. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Cevap n\u00f6ronlar\u0131m\u0131zda, yani sinapslarda her t\u00fcrl\u00fc bilgiyi, kimyasallar\u0131, elektri\u011fi, mekani\u011fi ve termi\u011fi ta\u015f\u0131yan h\u00fccrelerde olabilir. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Penrose Rogan'a birka\u00e7 y\u0131l \u00f6nce Stuart Hameroff'tan bir mektup ald\u0131\u011f\u0131n\u0131 ve Penrose'un n\u00f6ronlar\u0131 ve mikrot\u00fcb\u00fcl ad\u0131 verilen yap\u0131lar\u0131 dikkate almad\u0131\u011f\u0131n\u0131 ve bunlar\u0131n bilin\u00e7 i\u00e7in mutlak temel ara\u00e7 olabilece\u011fini s\u00f6yledi\u011fini anlatt\u0131. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Ne yaz\u0131k ki, n\u00f6ronlardaki kuantum etkilerini izole etmek m\u00fcmk\u00fcn de\u011fildir, \u00e7\u00fcnk\u00fc \u00e7evresel dekoherans elde edersiniz, kuantum durumunda \u00e7al\u0131\u015fan \u015fey, \u00fcst d\u00fczey bir \u00f6l\u00e7ekte yeniden \u00fcretilmez. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Penrose, Hameroff'un mektubunun i\u00e7eri\u011fi hakk\u0131nda Rogan'a \u015funlar\u0131 s\u00f6yl\u00fcyor: \"Kuantum durumunun \u00e7\u00f6kmesini bekleyebilece\u011finiz bir seviyeye kadar kuantum mekani\u011fini destekleyebilecek t\u00fcrden bir \u015feye benziyorlar.\" <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Mikrot\u00fcb\u00fcller<\/strong> Tubulin ad\u0131 verilen bir proteinden olu\u015fan k\u00fc\u00e7\u00fck t\u00fcplerdir, v\u00fccudumuzda farkl\u0131 i\u015flevleri vard\u0131r, ancak beyinde yap\u0131 deste\u011fi ve ta\u015f\u0131ma gibi geleneksel i\u015flevlerinin yan\u0131 s\u0131ra, mikrot\u00fcb\u00fcllerin n\u00f6ronda bilgi ta\u015f\u0131mada bir rol\u00fc olabilir (DENT; BAAS, 2014).<\/p>\n\n\n\n

G\u00f6r\u00fcn\u00fc\u015fe g\u00f6re, mikrot\u00fcb\u00fcl alt birimleri A-tipi ve B-tipi olmak \u00fczere iki farkl\u0131 etkile\u015fim t\u00fcr\u00fcne sahip olabilir. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

\u0130lki en simetrik olan\u0131d\u0131r, her y\u00f6nden ayn\u0131 g\u00f6r\u00fcn\u00fcrler. Beyinde mevcut olan A tipidir, simetri bilginin farkl\u0131 bir \u015fekilde organize edilmesine izin veren en \u00f6nemli \u00f6zelliktir.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Sonu\u00e7ta, bilin\u00e7 nedir? Joe'nun sorusu \u00fczerine Penrose, bilin\u00e7 d\u00fczeyimizde bu t\u00fcr bir kuantum durumunun korundu\u011funu ve kuantum etkisini ta\u015f\u0131yan \u015feyin mikrot\u00fcb\u00fcller olabilece\u011fini, ancak hen\u00fcz ke\u015ffetmedi\u011fimiz ba\u015fka yap\u0131lar\u0131n da i\u015fin i\u00e7inde olma ihtimalini g\u00f6z ard\u0131 etmedi\u011fini a\u00e7\u0131klad\u0131. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Penrose, bu sinapslarda ya\u015fayan bir molek\u00fcl s\u0131n\u0131f\u0131 oldu\u011fundan ve bunlar\u0131n be\u015fgenler ve alt\u0131genler gibi simetrik oldu\u011fundan, her girdapta Triskelion \u015fekilli bir proteine sahip oldu\u011fundan ve bir futbol topunun deseni gibi kenarlar\u0131 boyunca kendilerini birle\u015ftirdiklerinden \u015f\u00fcphelenmi\u015ftir. Ama sadece simetri yeterli mi? Bu proteinlerden yap\u0131lan maddeler de bir ba\u015fka \u00f6nemli fakt\u00f6r m\u00fcd\u00fcr? Ve bu proteinlerin sinapslardaki ger\u00e7ek i\u015flevi nedir? Ne yaz\u0131k ki hala bilmiyoruz.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

G\u00f6r\u00fcn\u00fc\u015fe g\u00f6re simetri, kuantum mekani\u011finde Yarn teller etkisi ad\u0131 verilen bir \u015feyde kilit bir rol oynuyor. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Bu durum, olduk\u00e7a simetrik bir yap\u0131ya sahip oldu\u011fumuzda ve en d\u00fc\u015f\u00fck enerji seviyesi ile bir sonraki aras\u0131nda b\u00fcy\u00fck bir bo\u015fluk olmas\u0131 m\u00fcmk\u00fcn oldu\u011funda ortaya \u00e7\u0131kar. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

B\u00fcy\u00fck bo\u015fluk en d\u00fc\u015f\u00fck enerji seviyesi hakk\u0131nda \u00f6nemli bilgileri gizleyebilir, bu bilgi eksikli\u011fi sorunlardan biridir. Ancak Penrose, \"t\u00fcm bunlar bir t\u00fcr kuantum fenomeninin bir t\u00fcr \u00f6nerisi, orada hala anla\u015f\u0131lmas\u0131 gereken \u00e7ok \u015fey var\" diyor.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

 Penrose hakl\u0131, hala \u00f6\u011frenecek \u00e7ok \u015feyimiz var ve ad\u0131m ad\u0131m kafam\u0131z\u0131n i\u00e7indeki kuantum mekani\u011fi d\u00fcnyas\u0131 hakk\u0131nda daha fazla \u015fey ke\u015ffedebiliriz. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Baz\u0131 insanlar birbirimize ve evrene frekanslar ve dalgalar arac\u0131l\u0131\u011f\u0131yla ba\u011fland\u0131\u011f\u0131m\u0131z\u0131 s\u00f6ylerdi, belki de belli bir d\u00fczeyde \u00f6yleyizdir. Ancak kesin olarak bilmek i\u00e7in hala bu konuda daha fazla \u00e7al\u0131\u015fmaya ihtiyac\u0131m\u0131z var.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

E\u011fer program\u0131n tamam\u0131n\u0131 izlemek isterseniz, buraya t\u0131klay\u0131n<\/a> veya konu ve Penrose'un \u00e7al\u0131\u015fmalar\u0131 hakk\u0131nda daha fazla bilgi edinmek i\u00e7in a\u015fa\u011f\u0131da yay\u0131nlanm\u0131\u015f makalelerinden baz\u0131lar\u0131n\u0131 bulabilirsiniz:<\/p>\n\n\n\n

DENT, E. W.; BAAS, P. W. Bilgi ta\u015f\u0131y\u0131c\u0131lar\u0131 olarak n\u00f6ronlardaki mikrot\u00fcb\u00fcller. N\u00f6rokimya Dergisi<\/strong>, v. 129, n. 2, p. 235-239, abr. 2014.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

HAMEROFF, S.; PENROSE, R. Evrende bilin\u00e7: 'Ork VEYA' teorisi \u00fczerine bir inceleme. Ya\u015fam Fizi\u011fi \u0130ncelemeleri<\/strong>, v. 11, n. 1, p. 39-78, 1 mar. 2014.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

PENROSE, R.; LANDAUER, R. \u0130mparatorun Yeni Akl\u0131: Bilgisayarlar, Zihinler ve Fizik Yasalar\u0131 \u00dczerine. Bug\u00fcn Fizik<\/strong>, v. 43, n. 6, p. 73, 11 jan. 2008.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

N\u00f6robilim veya fizik alan\u0131nda \u00e7al\u0131\u015fan bir ara\u015ft\u0131rmac\u0131ysan\u0131z, \u015fu konularda bir infografik olu\u015fturman\u0131za yard\u0131mc\u0131 olabiliriz sinirbilim<\/a>, n\u00f6roloji<\/a>, h\u00fccre biyolojisi<\/a>, B\u0130YOK\u0130MYA<\/a>, molek\u00fcler bi\u0307yoloji\u0307<\/a>ve Fizik<\/a> Mind the Graph'de. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Amac\u0131m\u0131z, bilimsel i\u00e7eri\u011finizin akademik d\u00fcnyan\u0131n i\u00e7inden ve d\u0131\u015f\u0131ndan daha fazla insana ula\u015fmas\u0131n\u0131 sa\u011flamak, bilimi farkl\u0131 bir \u015fekilde iletmektir. Denemeye haz\u0131r m\u0131s\u0131n\u0131z?
<\/p>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Nobel Fizik \u00d6d\u00fcl\u00fc 2020 hakk\u0131nda yazd\u0131\u011f\u0131m bir ba\u015fka yaz\u0131y\u0131 okuma f\u0131rsat\u0131n\u0131z olduysa, \u00f6d\u00fcl\u00fc kazanan \u00fc\u00e7 ki\u015fiden biri olan Roger Penrose'u matematik ve kalk\u00fcl\u00fcs konusundaki inan\u0131lmaz becerileriyle hat\u0131rlad\u0131\u011f\u0131n\u0131zdan eminim. Penrose, bu \u00e7al\u0131\u015fmalar\u0131n\u0131n yan\u0131 s\u0131ra son birka\u00e7 y\u0131l i\u00e7inde [...] hakk\u0131nda makaleler de yay\u0131nlad\u0131.<\/p>","protected":false},"author":4,"featured_media":11946,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":[],"categories":[959],"tags":[805,554,775],"yoast_head":"\nJoe Rohan, the Podcaster and Roger Penrose, the Nobel Prize<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Joe Rogan invited Sir Roger Penrose to his podcast. 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